200: The One Where My Daughter Takes the Mic

Sabrina: On today’s episode of the Shoot It Straight podcast, we are celebrating episode 200. My friends, I cannot believe that I am saying that. I remember back when I started the podcast, I was so nervous. Is anyone gonna listen? Is anyone gonna get anything out of this? Is this just gonna be a big waste of my time and effort and energy?

And here we are, 200 episodes later, and I’m so honored, and I’m so grateful for you and humbled that you want to have me in your ears most weeks. So thank you for being here. We wanted to do something really special to celebrate episode 200, and so thought really hard about who could a really cool guest be.

And well, I think we’ve got it for you today. I think it is safe to say this is going to be such a fun episode, and I think you are going to absolutely love it, because we have none other than my daughter on the podcast. So let’s listen to the episode.

Welcome to Shoot It Straight, the podcast for women building businesses and lives they actually want. I’m Sabrina Gebhardt, and around here we believe in clarity over hustle, alignment over burnout, and giving yourself permission to want more, more ease, more beauty, more income, more space to live. So if you’re ready to grow without losing yourself in the process, you’re in the right place.

Welcome back to the Shoot It Straight podcast, my friends. This is such an exciting episode. This is episode 200. I honestly cannot believe that I have made it to 200. When I started this podcast, I genuinely thought, “Maybe I’ve got a few things to say. Maybe I could be a little bit of a podcast.” Never in my wildest dreams did I think that we would have made it this far.

So welcome, and I’m so honored that if, whether you’re new here or whether you are one of the OG listeners, I’m so happy that you’re here. We wanted to do something really special for 200. I, it, I don’t know if you were listening back in episode 100, but back in episode 100, I had somebody special come and interview me, and that was a really great listen.

If you have not listened to it, absolutely go back and listen. But I wanted to do something different. And when I was asking around, specifically to my podcast producer, shout out to Haylee, she suggested today’s guest, and I immediately was like, “Yes.” And I went to this guest, and I proposed this idea to her, and she immediately, she looks at me and she goes immediately, “Yes.”

So I, we have, we’re both so excited about today. And I’m going to let her introduce herself, but ladies, I’m, I’m not even gonna say ladies and gentlemen, because it’s all ladies, ladies, we have my daughter Emerson with me on the podcast today. Honey, introduce yourself.

Emerson: Hi, guys. My name is Emerson. I’m a senior at Pasco High School, and I’m committed to the University of Missouri to study psychology next year.

Super excited. Can’t wait. And yeah, that’s basically my little introduction. I will start with the first question, which is what did you wanna be when you were my age, and does any of what you do now kinda correlate to back to what you wanted to be?

Sabrina: Okay, so fun fact, when I was younger than you, I wanted to be a photographer, which is wild.

Um, and I actually have proof of that. I went through… I was in Girl Scouts when I was younger. I was a, I was a Brownie, and my mom was my Girl Scout leader back then, and they gave us these little books that you’d, like, fill out, like, about you, and it’s like, “What’s your favorite color?” or “How old are you?

Who’s your best friend?” You know. Mm-hmm. Those kinds of questions. And one of them was, “What do you wanna be when you grow up?” And literally it says photographer in there. I came across that during one of our moves, and I was blown away, ’cause I didn’t, I don’t remember ever thinking that. Mm-hmm. So that was crazy.

But when I was your age, when I was graduating high school and going to college, I wanted to be a biology teacher, like a high school biology teacher, and a lot of that is because I, I love science and I loved biology specifically, but I had such an incredible biology teacher in high school, and she’s one of the people that, like, kind of instilled in me, like, look at the impact she’s having.

And, um, she was just such a great teacher, and I loved her so much, but I went to Texas Christian University, and they, the track to become a biology teacher at that particular university was the same biology track as pre-med students. Mm. Some universities, they have, like, an education science route and then, like, a medical science route, but at TCU they only had the one, at least back in the day.

Mm-hmm. I- that may be different now, but back in the day they only had the one, and I remember my college advisor telling me that, and she was like, “I don’t know if you’re gonna wanna do that here.” “Because it’s gonna be harder than it would be somewhere else.” And I wasn’t gonna transfer universities, and I was like, “I’m gonna give it a shot.

I’m gonna give it a shot. I love biology.” That track lasted less than one year. It lasted o- less than one year, uh, and then I, my grades really suffered and I had to pivot because I could not do that, so there you have it. This is, this is a question for you, Emmy. Um, do you feel like you’ve always understood what I do for work, and if not, like, do you remember when it clicked for you?

Emerson: Um, I would say whenever it was just straight- Photography I definitely did un- just understand because we would have, like, those little camera toys, and like, obviously it was just like, “Take a picture.” And so, like, all of us, me, Pax, and Ash were, like, obsessed with, like, photography and, like, taking pictures.

Like, you used to have, like, your old phones and I would give them… You would give them to me just the sole purpose for a camera, and it was just, like, so fun. So I did understand, like, that aspect of it, but I don’t think I understand all the other things and, like, parts of your job, especially now that you’re into, like, podcasting and, like, hosting retreats.

I didn’t understand that part until, like, I could under- like, fully understand it just by age. Yeah. Just when it comes by that, yeah, I would say.

Sabrina: Yeah, I think that makes sense because for sure Paxton does not understand what I do at all. But, like, photography, just being a photographer in and of it- Yeah … of itself.

It’s a, it’s a more understandable concept. Yeah. For

Emerson: sure. For sure. That makes sense. The next question is what are your non-negotiables when it comes to your business and being a mom, the things you’ll never been willing to trade out?

Sabrina: This is where being an entrepreneur is like a blessing and a curse, because I have full control over my job and also my role as a mom, meaning i- if I went to, like, a corporate job or worked in a hospital or had some sort of boss- Mm-hmm

I wouldn’t have full autonomy over my vacation time and my hours and the projects I was working on, and stuff like that, right? Somebody else would be telling me what to do. But having full autonomy over those things is also hard because I have to be willing to see if I’m working too hard or spending not enough time with the family, and I have to recognize those things on my own, and it’s, it’s a good thing and a bad thing.

Now that I’ve been in business for over 15 years it’s easier than it used to be, um, which we’ll get into a little bit later further in the questions. But now, 15 years in, non-negotiable for me is I want to be present for as many of the important things for you three as I can, right? The games, the practices, the award ceremonies, the s- big school events.

You know, now for you there’s so many things. Senior year. Um, the taking photos of things, the hosting things, all of that stuff. Like, that all is really, really important to me. But when you guys were younger, that was harder for me because I was still very much in, like, the building business phase. And also because you were younger it didn’t seem at the time, and listeners you can agree with me or not, disagree with me here, it didn’t seem at the time that there were as many important things to you guys as there are now.

Like, I’m able to recognize that your, you know, volleyball games and award ceremonies and prom photos are very important. Those are, like, life, like, milestones. But when you guys were under elementary school age when it was, like, five and three and one- It’s like missing things meant missing volunteering at preschool or it just, it didn’t seem as big, so I would talk myself into missing things more back then, which I don’t necessarily, um, I’m not necessarily proud of or love.

But now, 15 years in, non-negotiable for me is making sure that my schedule allows for me to be at all the things, and also to have a little bit more flexibility in my days so that when things come up unexpectedly, I can rearrange when needed, right? And that is also something that’s changed over time.

The listeners of the podcast know, and I’ve talked about this many times before, but I did not used to have as much white space in my calendar as I do now, and it made it really, really hard for when things popped up unexpectedly for me to shift and do anything about it. And so a lot of times I was forced to miss things just because of last minute stuff that got thrown in, and, and I really try not to do that anymore, which is just something that I’ve learned

Emerson: over time.

And I feel like you’ve been… Like, I don’t think you’ve missed any, like, big things, especially, like, senior year, ’cause there is a lot. Like, if anything, like, prom was last weekend, and, like, you were there photographing and like… So, like, I feel like your business also incorporates into, like, my life too in, like, that way.

Like, she photographed some of my volleyball games back, way back when. Like, like, prom, all the homecoming dances for, like, every single year you’ve done. And so, like, you don’t miss… It’s not, it’s not that you don’t miss. It’s that you are also adding, like, a f- aspect of photography into, like- Yeah … my life based on, like, doing those things.

Sabrina: Yeah. I also am really interested to see if that continues with the boys. You want me to do those things- Yeah, I don’t know … and they don’t… Like, you’ve always asked. ‘Cause, like, the

Emerson: guys hate, they hate pictures. Yeah,

Sabrina: yeah. Like, you’ve always asked, “Can you take the photos? Can you come take photos at a game or a tournament?

Can you,” whatever. And the boys, not so much. Yeah. So it’ll be interesting to see. I will say, you’re,

Emerson: like, in our friend group, it’s like, “Oh, Ms. Gephart’s got it.” Like, she’s like- Yeah … she’ll do it. Like, she did our senior photos in, like, the grass, like, cute little, like, decision day, all that stuff. We’re like, “Who should take it?

Oh, Ms. Gephart.” Yeah. Like, so it’s just, you’re just kind of known for that, and so I feel like, I don’t know. Like, I do think it won’t be the boys reaching out. It’ll be, like, the parents- Yeah, I can see that … being

Sabrina: like, “Can you do that?” Yeah, I can see that. Uh, so yeah, that’s gonna be interesting to see how that goes.

Okay, question for you. What’s a memory you have of me working that’s always stuck with you, good or bad? Good or bad. You can throw me under the bus here if you- … if you feel the need to. Hmm.

Emerson: I would probably say just, like, all of the trips that we’ve been on, like, solo or, like, family just, like, relating around, like, your job, and it was just, like, so cool to me.

And I, like, my role in it, my role in it was, like, making the baby laugh or, like, something. And it was, like, so fun to get, like, behind the scenes and, like, hang out with all of Mom’s, like, cool friends And like, we went, where did we go? Whenever we saw Coleen, we like got dinner with her, and that was just like, I like felt so cool.

Yeah. Like, just like hanging out and like being like a shadow almost to you. Yeah. And like your job, it’s like very like interesting, ’cause it’ll always be different. Yeah. Like, I’ve never been … ‘Cause I’ve been to a good couple of your shoots. You have. And- You’ve been to a bunch, yeah … like none of them have been the same.

Like, all different. Yeah. And like whenever we have the photo shoots in the little, like what is it called? Like, white space. Yeah, in the studio. Like, in this little studio. Like, I like check the people off when we do like the five minutes, and like playing with the kids, which has been like super fun that like knowing that like your job is different every single day.

That’s what I want my job to look like. Yeah. Like no same days, no office job. And like being around you has like implemented what I want for my like future job too as well. Yeah.

Sabrina: Yeah. The, the listeners have probably heard me talk about this. It’s been, it’s been a minute since we’ve talked about this. But something that I implemented in my photography business probably five years in was travel sessions, and I only, I don’t think I ever took more than five a year, and they were generally between the months of like March and September, maybe October.

The, the rule was though that I always took one of the kids with me And so it got to be like a solo one-to-one trip with a kid, but also, like Emerson said, getting to see me work, because I did think that was really, really important. And that’s actually something about my business that I’m really, really proud of.

Because, like you said, it’s been really cool for you to get to see what that’s like, but also really cool for me because we’ve gotten to take some cool trips and have- Mm-hmm … some really incredible experiences. Yes, some of these sessions that you’ve helped with have been local, and like mini sessions and different events, which has been really, really fun.

But also, I mean, we went to Charleston, we went to 30A, we’ve been to New York. Uh, we’ve done these travel sessions in different places where we’ve gotten to experience going to these locations, and then we have to go scout at- Mm-hmm … different times of day, and like come up with a plan. And I’m telling her, like, “Here’s what I’m seeing lighting-wise, and here’s how I think this is gonna work.”

And then when we actually do photograph the session, she’s taking behind-the-scenes and she’s watching me work. Is it a little bit boring? Sure, for, for them. But I’ve always instilled in my kids, not so much Emerson, more so with the boys, but instilled in them, “I know that this is not the fun part of the trip and you want to take an adventure.

But we are here because these families paid for me to be here. So you can suck it up and be bored for a little bit, and take behind-the-scenes footage, and for an hour or two hours or whatever, and then we get to have fun for the whole rest of the time that we’re here.” Mm-hmm. And it’s just, we’ve gotten to do some really cool things.

Mm-hmm. So I love that you brought that up. I love it.

Emerson: Okay, my turn. Um, so going back to, like the family stuff, did you ever feel like you missed out on something, like with the kids or just the family in general, because of your business?

Sabrina: Uh, definitely. Not so much in the past few years. Well, yeah, okay. Yes, there’s always things.

There’s always a give and take. I cannot be, just by the nature of the amount of hours there are in a day, I cannot be a 100% full-time mom and 100% full-time business owner at the same time. It’s a balancing act all the time. And sometimes business gets a little more priority, and sometimes family gets a little bit priority.

I- it has, like I said earlier, gotten so much better as you guys have gotten older and as I have become more of an experienced business owner and taken more control and autonomy over what I want my life to look like. In the beginning, when you guys were younger, the running joke with my husband and I was that the couple of Saturdays that I would have to miss for sessions, it was a guarantee that you or your younger brother, Ashton, would score a goal at soccer while I was gone, and those were the only goals during the season.

And it was like absolute clockwork. I would be gone hosting mini sessions or, uh, photographing a newborn or whatever, and I would get a text message, “Emerson just scored a goal. Ashton just scored a goal.” And I’m like, “Of course they did. Of course they did.” And so those were always bummers, um, you know, missing those events.

But again, they were, they were much younger. I don’t even know if you remember this, you know? Mm-hmm. Nowadays it’s fewer and farther between, but there have been things I’ve missed. Uh, one of the things coming up for me right now is last year in 2025, I hosted a retreat in late February, and I was in Savannah, Georgia, hosting one of the Root to Rise retreats, having an amazing time.

And you guys were having snow here, which is super rare for that late in the year, and Steve texted me a video of, it was like 10:30 at night, and it had started, like, snowing and really s- like heavy and sticking to the ground that late, and it was, like, a school night. And Ashton woke up Paxton, and they went outside to play football in the dark in the snow.

And both of the boys have the biggest grins on their face, and it was such, like, a, like, a, a memory that they’ll both have forever, and I missed it, and I hated that. But also, I only host a couple of retreats a year, and there’s- Mm … like I said, there’s sometimes you’re just gonna miss stuff, you know? And it’s, it’s the way that it shakes out.

I, I can’t be at everything all the time. Um, so there are definitely things that I miss out on because of business, but like I said, I j- it’s, it’s the more unexpected stuff. Mm-hmm. You know? It’s not, it’s not intentional things- Mm … anymore, so. Uh, question for you. Was there ever a moment where you felt proud of me in a way that you didn’t expect?

This might sound

Emerson: corny But whenever you went viral on TikTok Because that’s my dream, guys. Like- … me and Mom love TikTok- Yes … so much, and we always make TikToks. Check it out @emersongephart. And so whenever she hit it, not even just hit it, but hit it before me, I was like, “I’m proud.

Sabrina: I

Emerson: just wish I was you.” Oh

Sabrina: my gosh, that is so funny.

The, uh, the listeners know that my 2026 obsession is TikTok because I… Emmy, you don’t even know this. You can go back and listen to this episode. There’s an episode about this that you can go listen to from a few months ago, um, where I was interviewing my content strategist, Jayden, and we were talking about TikTok.

The listeners know this ’cause I had talked about this multiple times already this year. I was a stalker on TikTok for a long time. Like, a user, but didn’t ever post anything. But then- Kind of in December when I was starting to think about my goals for this year, I was like, “I’m gonna freaking start showing up on TikTok because I got stuff to share-“

and it’s fun over there.” But I was still nervous because, you know, it’s a new platform. Mm-hmm. And I just didn’t know what to expect. And I have been on Instagram for, like, a decade, and it’s virtually impossible… I’ve gone viral on Instagram one time in 10 years, and it was just one of those things where it was the right thing at the right time, and it just popped off.

And, uh, I’ve told that story on the podcast before, and it was great. Loved it. Highly recommend. But that’s, like, the rarity. So much harder. It’s so much harder on Instagram. One of the things I’ve talked about over and over again o- why I love TikTok so much is it’s low-key easy to go viral on TikTok. Yeah.

I, I consider virality anything over 10,000 views and, and then it’s, like, extreme virality. I’ve had, I don’t know, eight or 10 things with over 10,000 views just since January. We’re recording this in May. I’ve had, uh, one almost at 100,000, one at 200,000, and as of today I have one at 2.5 million, and that’s the one she’s talking about, which is hilarious because for somebody who is, for all intents and purposes, a beginner at TikTok, 2.5 million and- is wild, is absolutely bananas.

So that’s funny. My highest is only 1.5, but who’s even

Emerson: counting?

Sabrina: Oh my gosh, that’s so funny. Okay. You’re up.

Emerson: Um, next question is when things got really hard, what kept you from quitting? When things got really

Sabrina: hard, what kept me from quitting? Uh, there’s a couple of layers to that question. When I think about things getting really hard, there’s different seasons in my business that I can think of.

The first general season that I can think of is probably around year three when my business had started to take off. I was filling my calendar with clients. You guys were still really young, and neither of you were in school full time. Uh, at that point you would’ve been, uh, seven and Ashton would’ve been four, and Paxton wasn’t here yet.

So I was still kind of in the trenches of motherhood and chasing my business. I really f- I was not in control of it. I was chasing it. It was growing faster than I could control, which is such a blessing, such a good problem to have, but I was not proactively guiding my business towards what my priorities were.

I was kind of just saying yes to everything, and I was so proud of myself that I was making money and people wanted to hire me. But I was also really burned out because I was photographing things that I didn’t love, and I did not have the white space we talk about now. I feel like I was missing things, even if it was not technically missing things with you guys, but, like, missing out on time with Dad.

Mm-hmm. You know? ‘Cause it was… I was very much in the nap time, bedtime hustle, you know, where when Dad’s home or when you guys are sleeping or resting, I’m working. And so that looked like a lot of evenings, a lot of weekends- And at that point, that is when I hired my first coach and went to my first retreat education experience because I was like, “I can’t continue at this pace.

And so it’s either get support to figure out what I’m doing wrong and how to do it better or burn it all down.” And I loved what I was doing too much. I did not wanna burn it all down. Mm-hmm. So I went the route of find support. That was a game changer for me. I’ve told that story on the podcast many times.

And I… There’s, there’s literally like a black and white line in my business, like a before and after. Before and after, like, after I made so many changes, and it’s because I didn’t know what I didn’t know before, and my business started to become what I really wanted it to be, and it started to feel good again.

Another time when it felt really, really hard was the season of life where, uh, within six months we lost Mimi, we lost my mom, we were living in the rental house over there and renovating this house. All of that happened within six months. It was absolute chaos, and it felt like managing all of those things emotionally, physically, plus managing you guys, plus my business, it was like too many balls were in the air.

And for me to not quit in that season was to pull back from as many things as I could. Mm-hmm. So I, uh, refunded a bunch of sessions. I said no to a bunch of things. I pulled back on as much as I could, and I leaned into s- seeing a therapist and, like, getting all of the mental support that I needed. And, um, that was a really, really tough season, and it took about a year, honestly, for me to kind of recover from all of that.

But on the other side, uh, when I started to feel like myself again, and I was able to build things back up in a real- from a really healthy position. Other than that, generally speaking, when things have gotten hard and I have felt like burning it all down, it’s remembering why I do what I do. And like you said, there’s, there’s always been two aspects of my business, the photography side and the education side.

And the photography side was always connecting with people and showing moms how beautiful their chaos is, and that is still… That will always be important to me, whether it’s through photos or just voicing that to them. But showing women that they can have a chaotic life, and they can love, be multi-passionate about things, whether it’s their family, their career, multi-career, whatever.

So reflecting that to them, whether through photos or just words, is really, really important to me. But then also pouring into others so that they can be the best version of themselves. You know, right now in this season, it’s pouring into other photographers who are women and helping them skip a lot of the mistakes that I made, you know?

‘Cause I’m coming from this… I’m, I’m standing on the peak looking down at all the mistakes- Mm … I made to get to where I am, and if I can help someone skip a few of those- Mm-hmm … um, and fast track their success so that they can have the life they want and also the business that they want- I’m su- super passionate about that, so it’s, it’s always been, like, remembering why I’m doing what I’m doing.

Mm-hmm. And that it does still resonate with me and it does still matter. I wanna talk to you about something for a second. I see this all the time in the industry: photographers who are good at what they do. They are genuinely talented, but they still feel like they’re one slow season away from questioning everything they’ve ever done.

They are still making decisions from a place of scarcity. They’re still running their businesses in a way that quietly exhausts them. I know that feeling because I’ve lived it, and I also know what it costs to stay there longer than you have to. Root to Rise is my mastermind for photographers who are done waiting for things to click on their own.

It’s a high-touch group program, and it’s one I’ve been running for years, which means it’s been refined, tested, and built on what actually works. Not a theory, not what worked for someone else. What is working for photographers in real businesses at real stages of growth. The women inside Root to Rise aren’t just growing their revenue.

They’re changing how they think, how they make decisions, how they show up. That’s the work, and that’s what makes the results stick. The next cohort isn’t open yet, but the wait list is, and that’s where you wanna be. Wait list members get first access, more details, the chance to have a conversation with me before the doors open to anyone else, and a discount at enrollment.

If you’ve been circling this and wondering if it’s for you, that’s your answer. Get on the list. SabrinaGebhardt.com/mastermind-waitlist. The link will be in the show notes. Back to the episode. What is something you’ve seen me struggle with that maybe you don’t think I’ve ever talked about publicly?

‘Cause on the podcast we share everything, so. Mm-hmm. Is there anything that you can think of?

Emerson: Um, I would, I wouldn’t really say, like, business-wise, just, like, in life. Yeah. Am I allowed to say that? Yeah, absolutely. Okay. I have two maybe. Okay, go for it. Don’t wanna share your secrets. It’s okay. But that’s the question.

So the first one is just, like, the different changes of life that, like, me and the boys are going through right now. Like, I don’t know if you’ve talked about this, ’cause I don’t really listen to your podcast.

Sabrina: You’re not the ideal audience. That’s okay, honey.

Emerson: Um, but, like, how, like, I’m, like, graduating and obviously, like, leaving and, like, how it’s gonna be a lot different with, like, the boys.

Like, I drive them a lot and, like, do a lot. Um, so, like, how, like, our lives are gonna look different next year and just, like, all the different changes and, like, everything, and I know it’s hard because, like, it’s hard for me, too. And then the second one is probably… Ah. I’m not sure. Probably just, like, for me, like, having you as a very, like, feminine girl boss mom, like, it’s really changed my, like, perception of, like- Not only, like, my body, but, like, mental health is very important, and I feel like you do talk about that online.

But, like, I don’t think you talk about, like, how much you do push it on, like, us. Not pushing it in, like, a whatever way, but obviously, like, you’re very much the type of person, like, if you need help, like, come to me, but also, like, like, I’m not gonna force help on you. Like, if you need help, you can come to me, but I’m not gonna, like, put you through these things or, like, make you do these things just because I think you’re struggling.

Like, that was a very big, like, hump, I feel like. Not in our relationship, but, like, mainly, like, my life. Like, I was very, like, scared to ask for help, but you’re like, “It’s always gonna be here.” And so I feel like, like, people listening at home um, knowing that, like, your kids, like, sometimes you just have to, like, ask them and not just, like, kinda sit back and wait for them to come to you.

Like, you should ask them first. Like, if they’re, like, struggling with something, then, um, they’ll ask you for help.

Sabrina: Yeah. Yeah, a lot of that is the, just honestly, like, mother’s intuition. Like, we can tell. Mm-hmm. You know? And all three of you are so different, and you all present differently when you’re not doing well.

I do think for you, though, I think I’ve always come to you and said, like, “If there’s anything you wanna talk about,” or if there- Mm. But I think it’s taken you up until maybe two years ago to lean into that and, and respond with, “I actually am struggling with something, and I do wanna talk about it.” Mm-hmm.

‘Cause for a long time you were very much, like, ’cause you’re a strong… You- you are me as a child. You are a strong, independent woman, and it was very much, “I’m fine. I’ve got it.” Mm-hmm. “I don’t need help.” But in the past couple years you’ve really done a, a really brave job of saying, “You know what? I do need help.

I am struggling with this.” And sometimes that help is just having a conversation. Mm-hmm. Sometimes it’s, “Is there another resource? Is there something we can do about this?” You know, “How can we handle it? Is there a conversation w- we need to bring somebody else in,” or whatever. So that’s, part of that is your maturity, you know?

Mm-hmm. But I do think maybe you finally felt comfortable because it had been presented so many times. Mm-hmm. Yeah. You know? But to your point of saying, uh, me struggling with w- everything that’s gonna change in the last year, the audience knows all about that. I have talked about it many times already.

Um, and I’ve talked about it on Instagram, I’ve talked about it, um, here on the podcast, uh, with guests, by myself, whatever. N- this is not new news. But yeah, it is hard, and I, uh… One of my, one of my TikToks, going back to that, that went viral is about this very topic- Mm … of how hard it is to have a senior, because it’s an emotional rollercoaster of so insanely proud and also so emotionally devastated.

Like, what do you mean my reward- For raising you so well is that you’re going to leave me. You know, as a mom, that’s like a dagger to the heart, so. But I have been seeing a new therapist, and I, I’ve told the, the listeners this, but I got put on Lexapro this year, and so it’s helping me because I was having a lot of anxiety with that and feeling like I was losing a child, even though I know I’m not losing you.

You’re not going anywhere. We’re, we’re besties. But it’s hard ’cause, like, you’re not gonna be- Mm … in this house anymore, and, you know, how am I gonna help you when you’re sick, or a boy is, uh, rude to you- … or whatever, you know? Um, and then also, like you said, the, what the dynamic of what our house is gonna be like without you gone for all those months next year, and, uh, just going through ju- just being a boy mom.

Mm-hmm. I’m gonna need a new hobby or a new pet or a new something. I don’t know. Yeah, it’s been really, really hard, and obviously it’s something that we’re just gonna figure out, and we’re gonna get to the other… You’re gonna figure it out, I’m gonna figure it out, we’re gonna figure it out together. It’s not fun, but here we are.

Okay, you’re up.

Emerson: Okay. If you could go back to when I was little, is there anything you’d do differently?

Sabrina: If I could go back to when you were little. Okay, so here’s the honest truth. W- before you were born, this is not gonna shock you, before you were born, I was, like, ready to be a mom. I had read all the books.

I had checklists. I had a schedule printed out on a clipboard when I came home from the hospital, and I was, like, going to do the thing so well. And I, I just was like, “Oh, I’ve read everything. This is gonna be easy. Like, no big deal.” And spoiler alert, it was not. Nothing went to plan, and j- literally from the very beginning I felt like I was failing, and it was a, an emotional rollercoaster.

And I believe I’ve told this story on the podcast before, but when you were, like, a week old is when I made the drastic decision to not go back to work. Dad and I had gone through all of the planning of choosing a daycare, putting a deposit, touring different places. We had a plan. I loved my job at the time, loved what I did, was making good money, loved my boss, loved my team.

I mean, it was just like a dream job, and I just had al- I was going to be a working mom. Like, I just was. And then you were, like, a week old, and I was like, “I can’t leave you with strangers.” And immediately Dad was like, “Um, you make more money than me, so this is a problem.” Uh, and we did a huge pivot, sold our house, downsized, downsized our finances, and I was like, “No, we’re gonna make this work.

I’m going to be a stay-at-home mom.” That was, that lasted one year of me being a stay-at-home mom. It was, I was focused too much on doing it well, which is, this sounds terrible. I was focused so much on being, like, a Pinterest mom that I wasn’t enjoying just having a baby. And the, the way I can say that is because when Paxton, my third, was a baby, he was a surprise pregnancy.

We knew we would- he was gonna be our last, and I was able, because you were eight years old at that time, an eight-year difference between my oldest and my youngest, I had hindsight. I had hindsight’s 20/20. I was able to simply enjoy him being a baby instead of wishing away everything. Mm-hmm. You know, with you, I was so ready for, like, you to start smiling, and you to start laughing, and you to start crawling, and you to start sitting, and you to start walking, and I was constantly ready for the next thing, and I wasn’t just enjoying where we were, which I think is absolutely normal for women with firstborn children.

And a year into you being, uh, me being a stay-at-home mom to you is when I just, I got bored. I was like, “I love being home with you,” but that’s when I started sewing. Mm-hmm. And then that very quickly turned into me sewing children’s clothing and opening an Etsy shop, which then turned into me photographing the clothing, which then turned into me photographing other kids and starting my business, and here we are.

But I, it’s like I needed a piece of something that was still me. Like, I almost feel like I lost my identity a little bit, and I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that. Part of that’s probably my personality type. But I just, I wasn’t just enjoying. N- and, and I hope you don’t hear that and think, “Mom didn’t enjoy me.”

I did enjoy you immensely. Mm-hmm. But I feel like I was just always so focused on what’s next and what’s coming. And like I said, in contrast, when Paxton was a baby, I, for some reason, and I think it’s just because I had been a mom three times over at that point, I was able to fully relax. You know what I mean?

Mm-hmm. And not wish anything away, even the, like, crying in the middle of the night, teething. I was like, “Well, this is not gonna last forever. I’m just gonna hold you,” you know? So, okay, has watching me build this business changed how you think about what you want your own life to look like?

Emerson: Yeah. I feel like, like I was saying earlier, I definitely made me realize that I’m not built for an office job.

It’s way too boring, and also it showed me that I wanna work with kids, like, 100%. That’s, like, an, that’s a non-negotiable. I need to work with kids when I’m older. And so those two things combined, I don’t know if I’m gonna do this, but right now I’m studying psychology to become a pediatric occupational therapist.

I don’t know if that’s gonna stick, um, but that connects kids with the brain so well, and so that’s what I wanna do as of now. But… And it, there’s not an office job.

Sabrina: So yeah. Yeah. I love that. You’ve definitely never seen me in an office. Mm-mm. You know? Um, you’ve seen me- I, and I don’t even know if you, I don’t even know if you’ve, like, fully realized that you’ve seen me do this, and you may not until later in life, but, like, that I’ve just kinda made it up as I’ve gone along.

Mm-hmm. You know what I mean? That I… Like, you know we have our summer family meetings- Mm-hmm … the beginning of summer where we lay out the ground rules of, like, how the heck is mom gonna work when you guys are home, and how are we gonna play and work and, and I’m just constantly reevaluating, like, what is having a business look like in this season?

Am I traveling? Am I home? Am I going to conferences? Am I working when you’re at school? Like, what, you know, what does that look like? And having that freedom as an entrepreneur or in different types of jobs is really amazing. Mm-hmm. It is. Okay, let’s get to the last couple of questions. I feel like we’ve been chatting for a while.

I don’t know if we actually have, but this has been so fun. Okay. Y- one, one more for you and one more for me.

Emerson: Okay.

Sabrina: What do you want our

Emerson: relationship… This is gonna make me, like, sad. What do you want our relationship to look like when I’m fully an adult? What are you actually hoping

Sabrina: for? This is something, I haven’t even told you this yet, but this is something that came up with my therapist.

Because I told you that when you went to camp last summer, when y- sh- she went to camp last summer for a month, it was the longest time she’s ever left. It was the first time she flew alone, traveled alone. And I told you this, that when you left, I basically had to run out of the… I, I was with you at the gate.

I had to, like, run out of the airport to get to my car before I started weeping, and I had to sit in the car for like 30 minutes ’cause I was crying so hard that I couldn’t drive. And then I proceeded to basically cry on and off for hours until I heard from you that night on the phone that you had made it to camp.

And then i- I felt better, but it was still, like, really hard with you being gone. And I, I remember at that time thinking, “This is not healthy.” Like, why am I having such a guttural reaction to her going to summer camp? And I remember thinking, “What is gonna happen to me when she goes to college?” Like, if I react that way, I w- I recognize that, like- Mm-hmm

that was not a normal response. So I t- and I was telling my therapist this, and I was telling her about it and, you know, she’s asking me, “Well, well, what is your biggest concern?” And I told her, I said, and you know this because you are into psychology and the brain and, and things like this and y- you know, oftentimes what our brain is telling us, like, we know that it’s not true, but we still can’t help have the physical- Mm-hmm

reaction that we’re having, right? Like, our body does one thing even though our brain’s- Mm-hmm … like, “Hello, you’re being dumb.” So in my mind, it’s that you’re gonna leave and never come back, but not in the way of, like, you’re gonna end up living in Missouri or somewhere else. Mm-hmm. But, like, you’re never going to come back.

Mm-hmm. And the reason that, that I think that is because that’s my lived experience because I, and the audience knows this, had a very rocky, unstable childhood. Literally the opposite of yours. Have a broken home, have a mother who had mental health illness, uh, extreme in and out of the hospital, medicated.

Did not have a relationship with my mother, so did not have a mother. So literally, my lived experience was, and I, I made the mental choice when I packed up to go to college, most kids pack up their clothes and their toiletries and some dorm stuff, um, but their room stays intact because they come home for Christmas and Thanksgiving and the summer.

I moved out, like everything, out of my house because I knew that I was never coming back and I never again, when I moved to TCU, I never once slept in my childhood bedroom again. Not that I’m estranged from my family, but when I went home, I would go stay at Mimi’s house because that was a safe place for me.

Home didn’t feel safe for me. But even then, I didn’t… I would visit home as little as possible. I never went home during the summer. Um, I literally went home for like Christmas and maybe one other time a year, and that was it. Even though my brain knows that you have a healthier, more stable home environment, and you have a better relationship with me and Dad and, and everything, my lived experience is one of when you go to college, you are s- broken from your family.

And my therapist was so incredible, and I was telling her this story and she said, “Well, it’s no wonder that you’re struggling with your daughter leaving so much. Your brain does not have a blueprint for what a healthy, successful mother-daughter relationship looks like after going- Mm-hmm … to s- to college.”

And she told me that and I was like mind blown because of course I don’t understand what that looks like. If I… A- and then I put myself in the shoes of some of my friends who are like super close with their moms today as adults. Mm-hmm. They are not struggling with their kids graduating nearly like I am because they know that like it can get better.

And so my therapist is like, “You’re just going to have to, you’re just going to have to go into it blind, trusting that it’s going to be good, and then like build the road as you’re walking,” which is so fascinating. So when you ask what do you want our relationship to look like when I’m, when you’re an adult, I want you to talk to me all the time.

I told you that recently. I told you that I, I expect you to check in every day, and you were like, “Every day, Mom?” And I was like, “Yes.” Which probably not every day, but I hear all these stories of my friends who are like, “I talk to my mom every day still,” or, “I talk to my mom every other day, and we still travel together, and we still spend time together, and, you know, I’m super close with her,” and like that is my dream.

But also my own lived experience is like what does that- Yeah … is that even possible? Because I did not experience that. But I have worked so hard as a mom to make our, to make your childhood experience and the boys, to make our family the opposite of what I grew up in. Dad and I have worked so hard to make sure that it is healthy and safe and that we have family jokes and inside jokes and memories and that we’re constantly pouring into each of you in different ways because we want to have that.

Like, my vision when you guys are all adults is that you’ll come home for stuff, and everybody’ll bring their spouses and their kids, and then it’s gonna be this loud, laughing hilarity of, like, adult relationships, and that we’re gonna remember, like, the inside jokes and the times that this, that, and the other happened, and that the people that you guys marry are, are gonna come into our family and be like, “This is literally the best family ever.”

Like, that’s my dream. So what do I want our relationship to be like? I hope that it gets better. That’s what I hope. Which I think is pretty great now, but I hope it gets better. Okay, last question: What’s something you wish the people who listen to this show who only know the public version of me actually knew about me?

Emerson: Mm. Like something funny or serious? Right, whatever.

Sabrina: Whatever.

Emerson: Okay. Mom is the most… Love her to death, but- Oh,

Sabrina: no. Oh, no …

Emerson: she’s the most road rage person- … I’ve ever, I’ve ever met in my life. Like, literally, like, there would, there would be, like, a grandma walking across the street, and she could be like, “Can you walk any slower?”

Like yelling. Like, “Light’s green. I have to go.” And because of that, I have very bad road rage too. Like, I catch myself speeding a lot. I actually have a ticket, so that’s really great. And so yeah, me and Mom are probably, like, crazy drivers in this house.

Sabrina: Let me say, though, when she says road rage, first of all, my child is exaggerating.

I- She would yell. Okay, I do yell. But I would never hurt anyone. Okay, no. Which when I think of road rage, I think of, like, the psychos that, like- Oh, yeah … pull, like, stop their car and, like- No … you know. I would never hurt anyone. I would never, whatever. I am, I am a safe driver. But I do get real pissed off-

Emerson: Mm-hmm

Sabrina: if somebody doesn’t go when the light is green.

Emerson: We’ve flipped people off multiple

Sabrina: times. Or, or, yes, the people that cross a crosswalk when I’m waiting to turn, and they’re just moseying at, like, snail speed. I’m like, “You see me waiting.” “Can you pick up the pace?” Um, yeah, I do get a little frustrated in the car.

I do. That’s for sure. And I love that you’ve picked that up, so good job me. Um, anything else that you think the audience wouldn’t know about me- Mm … or would find interesting to know about me? Do, do they know about how Mom

Emerson: used to have a pink car back in the day? I didn’t have a pink car. Was it not pink?

No. Red? It was

Sabrina: white

Emerson: It had pink accents though

Sabrina: No, her name was Diva Oh.

Emerson: Well, yeah, she had a car named Diva, guys

Sabrina: I had a car named Diva. That was my very first car, and she was an absolute hoopty. Uh- I swear it was pink … no. No, it was white, and it was… My dad s- was a single parent, and, you know, life’s expensive, and he…

I came home from school one day, and he had it in the car, and Diva was a convertible, so she had that going for her. That was the only redeeming quality. But Dad was, like, like cleaning her out and, like, getting her ready, and I got dropped off from school, and I walked in, and I immediately knew that this was for me, because it wasn’t Dad’s car.

Mm-hmm. And I was like, “What’s this?” And he was like, “I bought this for you.” And this should go to show you how, first of all, I’m spoiled, and I also have very expensive taste. I was pissed. I was pissed. I did not tell him that I was pissed, but I remember being like, “Okay.” “I’m supposed to drive this?” But what is amazing is that my two best friends at the time, one of them, you’ve met them both, Amanda and Jen.

Mm-hmm. My two best friends at the time came over, and they hyped it up like nobody’s business, which made me feel better- Yeah … ’cause they were, like, such good friends. And we had some times in Diva. And you know what the great thing is about having a car that’s, like, beat up and not in great condition? You don’t have to take care of it.

So it was honestly a perfect car for a 16-year-old, and it did the job. Mm-hmm. It got me to and from school, and choir, and drill team, and all, and my job, and all the things. And I thought I was gonna be embarrassed driving her, but then everybody hyped her up and loved that she was so ugly, and it was- Great.

We got a little s- sparkly sticker that said Diva and put it on the front and called it a day. Mm-hmm. So yeah, that was my first car. Yeah. Um, she’s quite the, quite the difference from Coco, which is my car now. Yeah. Um, all right, my friends. That is it for episode 200. I hope that you have loved getting to know my daughter a little bit and getting to hear this chat and kind of our dynamic.

Sweetheart, I appreciate you being here and your time.

Emerson: Bye, guys. Thanks for having me.

Sabrina: Thanks so much for listening to the Shoot It Straight podcast. You can find all the full show notes and details from today’s episode at sabrinagebhart.com/podcast. Come find me and connect over on the Gram at xo.sabrinagebhart.

And if you’re loving the podcast, I’d be honored if you’d hit that subscribe button and leave me a review. Until next time, my

friends.